2.2.3 Patch Release

[bobatealee]

The 2.2.3 Patch for Team Fortress 2 Classic has been released. To apply this update to TF2 Classic, use the latest version of our downloader. The major changes include:

Weapon Changes:​

• Updated the Admiralty Anchor:
  • First person animation state no longer waits to go idle in order to update when airborne or landing
  • Players now properly sink and are slowed down in water while active
  • Updated sound effects for drawing, swinging and crit swinging
• Updated the Cyclops:
  • Now gives 1 Bonus Point if 3 or more enemy stickies are destroyed at once
• Updated the Mine Layer:
  • Reduced maximum active mine count to 3 (from 6)
• Updated the Anti-Aircraft Cannon:
  • Updated firing and rev sounds
  • Added unique explosion sounds
• Updated the Rejuvenator:
  • Updated first person animations
  • Fixed Uber Generator gibs not using the correct team skin
• Updated the Shock Therapy:
  • Heal sounds and particles are no longer predicted by the client. This should fix cases where they would emit without a successful heal

Map Changes​

• Updated VIPR Drizzle:
  • Time gained on capping mid increased to 60 seconds (up from 45)
  • Fixed an out-of-bounds teleporter exploit
  • Fixed an in-bounds teleporter exploit
  • Fixed the one-way door grates being visible through geometry when open
• Updated VIPR 2Bridge:
  • Time gained on capping mid increased to 60 seconds (up from 45)
  • Fixed out-of-bounds teleported exploit
  • Fixed some windows floating at mid
  • Tons of clipping fixes
• Updated VIP Harbor:
  • Updated detailing in the Harbor and 3D Sky areas
  • Fixed some misaligned spotlights
  • Fixed visible nodraw brushes
  • Overhauled soundscapes throughout the map
• Updated PL Jinn:
  • Fixed rollback issues at final
  • Fixed a visible nodraw above B
• Updated CP Dustbowl and PL Goldrush:
  • Synchronized with their latest changes from Korkade
• Updated CP Gorge and CP Yukon:
  • Fixed some visual regressions

Miscellaneous Changes:​

• Servers with the lowest ping are now prioritized in the main menu server list, provided they have active players
• Raised main menu server list update rate to 40 seconds (from 10)
• Fixed a crash related to the VIP Race HUD when a player disconnects
• Fixed a crash caused by changing levels while a color_correction_volume entity is active
• Fixed a bug that caused a looping crit sound when killed while crit boosted
• Fixed a bug where the VIP Race HUD would sometimes incorrectly display a VIP's dead/alive state
• Fixed a potential exploit that would allow any player to pause the map timer
• Prevented players from somehow muting themselves
• Fixed cl_autorecord being entirely non-functional
• Marked tf2c_convert_nav_file as a cheat command
• Added an extra check to prevent non-server hosts from using TF-specific navmesh edit commands
• Implemented mod_allow_self_dmg_dot_weapon, hit_self_on_miss attributes
• Implemented tf2c_attack_during_freeze
• TFBot: Removed some leftover commands that would crash dedicated servers
• TFBot: Fixed a crash when retreating and no valid cover area is found
• Updated localization files
  • Added Thai translation (Kas)
• Updated Medals

 

[Dinkster]

why do you guys keep screwing my boy Mine Layer over it's already weak asf and every time y'all change it its always a nerf

 

[Shens]

why do you guys keep screwing my boy Mine Layer over it's already weak asf and every time y'all change it its always a nerf

tbf, 2.2 did see it get buffed. but yeah, this change from 6 to 3 active mines is just misery-inducing for the eleven whole mine layer mains in the game.

 

[vilewitch]

Billions must actually pay attention to their traps and not get free kills.

At this point it really should just be taken out of the game, but I've expressed that enough.

 

[Dinkster]

tbf, 2.2 did see it get buffed. but yeah, this change from 6 to 3 active mines is just misery-inducing for the eleven whole mine layer mains in the game.

TRUTH NUKE

 

[kestrel]

Billions must actually pay attention to their traps and not get free kills.

At this point it really should just be taken out of the game, but I've expressed that enough.

god forbid the weapon is allowed to be good at its niche

 

[vilewitch]

god forbid the weapon is allowed to be good at its niche

It is still good at the thing it was already good at, you just can only hold one choke with it instead of two. It is still an an automatic trap that you don't need to pay any attention to, which itself is a fundamentally flawed idea, but now it's just slightly less annoying.

 

[vilewitch]

why do you guys keep screwing my boy Mine Layer over it's already weak asf and every time y'all change it its always a nerf

It just got buffed like crazy in 2.2 tho? It was a genuine problem weapon for a while and super frustrating to fight.

 

[Dinkster]

It just got buffed like crazy in 2.2 tho? It was a genuine problem weapon for a while and super frustrating to fight.

if it was buffed in the previous update then it wasn't buffed enough. the fact nobody (and i mean NOBODY) uses this weapon clearly shows that. i assure you the reason nobody uses this weapon is NOT because it's overpowered, but the exact opposite, it's weak af

 

[Dinkster]

long story short I'm right you're wrong

 

[kestrel]

It is still good at the thing it was already good at, you just can only hold one choke with it instead of two. It is still an an automatic trap that you don't need to pay any attention to, which itself is a fundamentally flawed idea, but now it's just slightly less annoying.

laying traps and not paying attention to them is the point of the weapon - there's literally an achievement for doing damage without seeing it happen. it's the same concept as the scottish resistance in live tf2 but better because you dont have to babysit multiple doorways instead of playing the video game

the 2.1.3 version was perfect and they should've left it there. having more mines out and making them explode faster was a fair trade for reducing their detection radius. you could seal off 2-3 routes whilst still contributing to your team. then 2.1.5 reduced the mine count for no reason, then 2.2 soft-reworked it into some bizarre automatic sticky launcher that nobody bothers to use for trapping
you only see people spamming it into chokepoints and doorways like a secondary grenade launcher because it maximises range and fires automatically at a high speed. that's so much more braindead than using it to lock down flank routes, which is what you're supposed to do with it

now in 2.2.3 we have the worst of both worlds - shitty rework and reduced mine count. the weapon is in the worst place it's ever been design wise and it should just be reverted to its 2.1.3 design. it's bad at its niche and worse than the sticky launcher for both combat and trapping

 

[vilewitch]

laying traps and not paying attention to them is the point of the weapon - there's literally an achievement for doing damage without seeing it happen. it's the same concept as the scottish resistance in live tf2 but better because you dont have to babysit multiple doorways instead of playing the video game

Correct, and I've been of the belief that it is a very bad concept to have in the game and I am happy to hear that they may be reworking it into something else. You should not be able to lock multiple chokes without paying any attention to them at all, while still being one of the most potent combat classes in the game. Engineer can get away with it because it takes time and resources to set up a sentry, and once it's destroyed he can hardly do anything without his team around. The devs reducing the mine count shows that they know this is a problem. 2.2 made it just straight-up great at spamming and trapping, as just a sticky launcher with zero human input outside of firing. I've gone over this quite a lot, and while it sucks that we have a weapon that is effectively useless until they change it, I'm glad they aren't keeping it in its most problematic state unaltered while we wait on the Steam release. I would rather have an unused weapon than a weapon that's actively detrimental to the gameplay experience for everyone that isn't the player using it.

 

[kestrel]

Correct, and I've been of the belief that it is a very bad concept to have in the game and I am happy to hear that they may be reworking it into something else. You should not be able to lock multiple chokes without paying any attention to them at all, while still being one of the most potent combat classes in the game. Engineer can get away with it because it takes time and resources to set up a sentry, and once it's destroyed he can hardly do anything without his team around. The devs reducing the mine count shows that they know this is a problem. 2.2 made it just straight-up great at spamming and trapping, as just a sticky launcher with zero human input outside of firing. I've gone over this quite a lot, and while it sucks that we have a weapon that is effectively useless until they change it, I'm glad they aren't keeping it in its most problematic state unaltered while we wait on the Steam release. I would rather have an unused weapon than a weapon that's actively detrimental to the gameplay experience for everyone that isn't the player using it.

this entire diatribe reeks of sour grapes. you tipped your hand by admitting that you're actually happy the weapon now serves no purpose in the game. i can't fathom having a vendetta against the minelayer of all things (least of all when nobody's using it - i wonder why that could be?) it's one of the most inoffensive weapons unique to TF2C. it's like getting mad at the existence of the brick or something

perhaps the devs wouldn't have had to nerf the mine count in the first place if they didn't turn it into a bastardized clone of the sticky launcher? i already said i'm not happy with the 2.2 rework because it massively dumbed the weapon down. the whole point of the minelayer is that it's supposed to make demo weaker in direct combat in exchange for letting him guard more areas for no attention cost. if you keep dying to mines you're supposed to go after the demoman himself. he sucks ass when he only has the pipe launcher to defend himself, least of all if a scout or pyro gets in his face (ironically the very classes the minelayer is supposed to counter, wow it's almost like that was deliberate design or something)

 

[vilewitch]

this entire diatribe reeks of sour grapes. you tipped your hand by admitting that you're actually happy the weapon now serves no purpose in the game. i can't fathom having a vendetta against the minelayer of all things (least of all when nobody's using it - i wonder why that could be?)

You can still use it to trap chokes with no effort, it's just limited to one now, which is a better case than it was at before. I am happy that it is not as problematic as it was before, but the core concept of automatic no-effort bombs/traps is still fundamentally flawed and I am thankful that it is rumored to be getting reworked to something potentially different. Also, I would see the thing being used all the time, constantly getting spammed onto points and getting free zoning by just throwing them on the ground everywhere or blocking two entire choke points. I am not ashamed to admit that I dislike the weapon greatly, and that doesn't do anything to hurt my talking points. People hate the Scorch Shot, but its criticism is justifiable as it has many issues. I am not claiming that a weapon is problematic purely because I don't like it.

it's one of the most inoffensive weapons unique to TF2C. it's like getting mad at the existence of the brick or something

These are completely incomparable weapons.
Brick: Throwable on a seven second cooldown that lets you deal the equivalent of one melee hit, plus a little bit of knockback. Gets around 33 extra damage if you hit it at long range. Sacrifices your ability to use the pistol, which is a very solid medium range sustain fire option and finisher tool.

Mine Layer: Bomb launcher with longer default range and faster fire rate than stickies, that have the potential to kill players with zero input from the Demo, can be fairly easily hidden, and can also be spammed on points and around areas to provide free zoning and/or damage with, again, zero input from the Demo's part, all while he is still fully able to use his grenades simultaneously.

the whole point of the minelayer is that it's supposed to make demo weaker in direct combat in exchange for letting him guard more areas for no attention cost.

Yes, except it doesn't make him much weaker in direct combat in its current form since the 2.2 rework, and allowing him to kill players at chokes with zero attention is a flawed idea. Engineer is the only other class that can do this and his entire character is built around area denial with weak direct combat, which Demo is not. Pipes do a shitload of damage and you can still use mines in combat to control the movement of your enemies, in the same way you can with stickies, to make pipes easier to hit. At least now with less mines you may be sacrificing a trap you have on a choke if you try to do this, which actually makes the Mine Layer weaker in close combat because you might not want to fire it which removes that zoning potential.

he sucks ass when he only has the pipe launcher to defend himself, least of all if a scout or pyro gets in his face (ironically the very classes the minelayer is supposed to counter, wow it's almost like that was deliberate design or something)

This is literally a weakness that is core to Demo and is not unique to the ML. Demo is always weak to rushdowns.

perhaps the devs wouldn't have had to nerf the mine count in the first place if they didn't turn it into a bastardized clone of the sticky launcher?

They clearly have no idea what to do with the ML while retaining the automatic mines. They wanted to keep it competitive with the Sticky Launcher but as a result accidentally emphasized why the core idea blows and needs to be changed.

I've already been personally blamed by some guy for being the reason the ML got nerfed (I am not but that was funny lol,) due to my thread in the Discord. I am more than willing to continue talking about this but I've gone on for long enough, and it seems that most of the people who argue with me about this just don't agree that the core concept is an issue, which I don't think any amount of attempts at convincing will work at this point. So I'll just leave it here.

 

[kestrel]

You can still use it to trap chokes with no effort, it's just limited to one now, which is a better case than it was at before. I am happy that it is not as problematic as it was before, but the core concept of automatic no-effort bombs/traps is still fundamentally flawed and I am thankful that it is rumored to be getting reworked to something potentially different. Also, I would see the thing being used all the time, constantly getting spammed onto points and getting free zoning by just throwing them on the ground everywhere or blocking two entire choke points. I am not ashamed to admit that I dislike the weapon greatly, and that doesn't do anything to hurt my talking points. People hate the Scorch Shot, but its criticism is justifiable as it has many issues. I am not claiming that a weapon is problematic purely because I don't like it.


These are completely incomparable weapons.
Brick: Throwable on a seven second cooldown that lets you deal the equivalent of one melee hit, plus a little bit of knockback. Gets around 33 extra damage if you hit it at long range. Sacrifices your ability to use the pistol, which is a very solid medium range sustain fire option and finisher tool.

Mine Layer: Bomb launcher with longer default range and faster fire rate than stickies, that have the potential to kill players with zero input from the Demo, can be fairly easily hidden, and can also be spammed on points and around areas to provide free zoning and/or damage with, again, zero input from the Demo's part, all while he is still fully able to use his grenades simultaneously.


Yes, except it doesn't make him much weaker in direct combat in its current form since the 2.2 rework, and allowing him to kill players at chokes with zero attention is a flawed idea. Engineer is the only other class that can do this and his entire character is built around area denial with weak direct combat, which Demo is not. Pipes do a shitload of damage and you can still use mines in combat to control the movement of your enemies, in the same way you can with stickies, to make pipes easier to hit. At least now with less mines you may be sacrificing a trap you have on a choke if you try to do this, which actually makes the Mine Layer weaker in close combat because you might not want to fire it which removes that zoning potential.


This is literally a weakness that is core to Demo and is not unique to the ML. Demo is always weak to rushdowns.


They clearly have no idea what to do with the ML while retaining the automatic mines. They wanted to keep it competitive with the Sticky Launcher but as a result accidentally emphasized why the core idea blows and needs to be changed.

I've already been personally blamed by some guy for being the reason the ML got nerfed (I am not but that was funny lol,) due to my thread in the Discord. I am more than willing to continue talking about this but I've gone on for long enough, and it seems that most of the people who argue with me about this just don't agree that the core concept is an issue, which I don't think any amount of attempts at convincing will work at this point. So I'll just leave it here.

you seem to think there is zero consequence in using the minelayer, that the fact demoman doesn't have to watch the routes he traps is enough to call the weapon poorly balanced. but the downside is inherent to the playstyle it used to encourage you to follow. the way you scramble to find ways to call the minelayer overpowered uses the exact same weepy tone as everyone who complained about heavy's autocannon when that first dropped (admittedly something i was guilty of doing, but i'm not still complaining about it after the nerfs were reverted because i learned to actually play around the weapon's weaknesses)

to repeat myself for the third time: i also do not like the 2.2 rework. i'm literally agreeing with you that it made the weapon worse and more susceptible to spamming and i don't know why they felt the need to keep changing it after 2.1.3. the base concept of the weapon is not flawed, but the way eminoma treats it is.

by the way i wasn't comparing the brick to the minelayer, i was saying they're both innocuous weapons and calling either of them poorly balanced is ridiculous. christ, if you think the minelayer of all things is OP, you'd have a heart attack if you played against the vaccinator in live TF2

 

[vilewitch]

you seem to think there is zero consequence in using the minelayer, that the fact demoman doesn't have to watch the routes he traps is enough to call the weapon poorly balanced. but the downside is inherent to the playstyle it used to encourage you to follow. the way you scramble to find ways to call the minelayer overpowered uses the exact same weepy tone as everyone who complained about heavy's autocannon when that first dropped (admittedly something i was guilty of doing, but i'm not still complaining about it after the nerfs were reverted because i learned to actually play around the weapon's weaknesses)

I'm not saying the ML is overpowered, and I have never once said that it is. I am saying it is an annoying, frustrating weapon to play against in ways that stickies and dynamite are not. They are functionally just stickybombs but with an entire part of the skill expression of stickies-- timing-- out of the question. There is a difference between saying that something is overpowered and saying something is flawed. The Natascha is a flawed, frustrating idea at its core but I would not claim that it is overpowered. The Vaccinator is incredibly overtuned to the point of being overpowered, but if they adjusted some numbers it could potentially be a lot more manageable to play against, maybe even fun. The core of the Mine Layer just straight-up doesn't fit into TF2 because it requires no input from the player using it to get kills, unlike every other weapon in the game save for Sentries.

Also, the AAC was certainly a little bit overtuned at its release, but I believe the blast radius reduction did bring it a lot more in line and it's in a great place now. The core concept-- giving Heavy an explosive burst damage weapon in exchange for less DPS and range-- is not a fundamentally flawed idea, it just needed minor tweaking for the actual implementation to be right.

to repeat myself for the third time: i also do not like the 2.2 rework. i'm literally agreeing with you that it made the weapon worse and more susceptible to spamming and i don't know why they felt the need to keep changing it after 2.1.3. the base concept of the weapon is not flawed, but the way eminoma treats it is.

Again, I'm not claiming that you like it. I also do not like it, I was implicitly agreeing with you on that. The problem Eminoma keeps having is that they keep changing the weapon around the flawed core idea of "stickies that do half the job for you" and trying to balance around such a shitty idea is a nightmare. They don't know how to make that idea work in a way that's fun to fight in any capacity while also being enjoyable to use as a sidegrade. That's not an insult to them, because truthfully, I don't think that you can make that idea more fun to go against. People don't like dying to kills that an enemy did not earn; this is something that is the case in like every multiplayer game. Mines/Claymores in military shooters, auto-combos in fighting games, random crits in base TF2, etc.

by the way i wasn't comparing the brick to the minelayer, i was saying they're both innocuous weapons and calling either of them poorly balanced is ridiculous. christ, if you think the minelayer of all things is OP, you'd have a heart attack if you played against the vaccinator in live TF2

Then why even bring up the comparison point when the two things aren't even comparable lol? The ML is heavily flawed in ways that make it not innocuous. They, in fact, make the weapon incredibly annoying. It's the most controversial weapon in the game and it's not even particularly close.

You just keep putting words in my mouth that aren't there, which to be fair I think I may have simply not illustrated my points well enough. But in all honesty, it's because I've already talked to death about it in the past and I'm tired of it, so this is the last reply I'm gonna make on this.

My overall feelings are that I'm glad it's getting a future rework, and I really hope that they do a good job with it and make it into something that's a lot more enjoyable to fight with and against. I don't particularly mind that my pick for the most annoying weapon in the game is currently in a state where it is less annoying before it gets its 7th(!!!) rebalance in due time.