[Resolved] Ban appeal: hawaw_dacar2

[hawaw_dacar2]

In game name: hawaw_dacar2
Time of ban:17:31 (Europe Time)
Date of ban: 7/09/23
Reason for ban: General toxicity, Supporting russia's war on ukraine

First thing first let's talk about the general toxicity. While im a salty and very often hard on the words i very well know why i got this first reason, i did a remark on the fact that an admin (fish bait) change oftenly of team side (not only this session) and was often staying longly on spectator side (from what i heard of its not allowed on full servers, i never had confirmation), while i conceed my way of saying it was bad saying, quote of me "you don't give a fuck about it" (talking about the general balance of the game) and "some people in the enemy team however" refering to two people changing team in the middle of the game for no oblivious reason (while our team was in major trouble and already umbalanced), while im rude here its no toxicity to talk about some people (maybe ?) breaking the rules

The second reason is supporting russia's war on ukraine, well well well now its getting VERY interesting (i ain't gonna be able to quote myself very well i don't find the time all of that happens), well first thing NO i don't support russia at ALL, it was a few weeks ago with once again with me and the administrator fish bait we had an argument about what happened for the ukrainian war to happen, this was only an OPINION from me mentioning the multiple revolution that happen to 1991 to today, i explained the fact that russia AND multiple countries were involved in those revolution mentioning The Orange Revolution of 2004 and the Maidan Hit of 2014 and the multiples Bombing Run by Azov Bataillon and the control over the east by Pravi Sektor Millicia on the east side of the country that happen in 2016 till present and also mentioning why Russia invaded Crimea just after (To ensure one of their only marine port in Black Sea), while i accept the fact that saying this so abruptly might be rude but don't i have just the right to explain myself ??? And for once i didn't even got rude or insulting. If you want my pure and honest opinion here it is. Russia is sending thousand of people to death and europe is sending guns and money to kill even more people, and this war was just never supposed to happen. If you understood my point of view (wich maybe false like all opinion) you would see i do not support russia and all of the "reasons" to send 80 tons of pure steel on a country are not valid. The famous denazification is a pure bullshit because the big Millicia are disbanded since long and the anexion of crimea was only for pure selfish reason's, while fish has his very own opinion (that i totally respect its his way of seing the thing) i don't think i deserve that one i just expressed myself and (maybe im wrong). There is no rule for just respectfull political and historic opinion, there is one for glorification of war and nazism but..... That ain't what im doing ??


Third part length of ban : Permanent really ? i never got banned (tbh i only got muted once and warned like 2 years ago or smth like that)
wich is ( i think) once again breaking the pattern of ban lenght


Last thing to conclude this unfortunate mess, i still do think i need to say sorry to the admin in question and i don't want anything bad for him i remember we were... Friends ? (i think ?) i don't mind him if he doesn't want to forgive me its his very own right , i know im hard on words, salty or whateveryou think i am but.

I still love this server, so much. Im here since immemorial times ive seen this game and his community grow, ive been here when the game nearly died, i seen old members I loved go away and see brand new and fresh players now very well known arrive.


My deep and honest sorry to everybody i might have triggered or importunated and i have still a litle bit of hope inside of me to just... come back and play with all the people I love and know.

In the hope you understand, Gauthier. (mostly known as Hawaw Dacar)

 

[hawaw_dacar2]

i nearly forgot, im kinda in a very sticky situation recently in real life (it doesn't explain anything don't take it like that) so im very irritable and can be way easely be triggered

 

[VintagePC]

Your appeal has been received and I'll get back to you in the next few days.

 

[VintagePC]

Apologies for the delay. There's a lot to unpack here and for me to review so while I had the intent of getting to it tonight I have other commitments so I will need another day or so.

 

[hawaw_dacar2]

Apologies for the delay. There's a lot to unpack here and for me to review so while I had the intent of getting to it tonight I have other commitments so I will need another day or so.

I understand all of this is very hard. Take the time it needs.

 

[VintagePC]

Third part length of ban : Permanent really ? i never got banned (tbh i only got muted once and warned like 2 years ago or smth like that)
wich is ( i think) once again breaking the pattern of ban lenght

Uhh... try 2 months ago. What I gather from that incident is you were being rather aggressive towards one of the TF2C developers and when one of our staff asked you to stop you started getting snippy with them too.

As for ban length, we are explicitly clear in the rules that they are not set in stone and that we reserve the right to adapt them as the situation warrants. More on this later.

I'm not even going to attempt to make sense of your wall of text because it paints a narrow view of the overall issue at hand, and some of it feels like you're either trying to double down on some of the things you said, are concern-trolling, or both. You're allowed to have opinions, but along with that comes the responsibility of knowing where and when is an appropriate place to debate them, and if we don't want to provide you a soap-box to stand on then that's our prerogative.

There's another report from early July (that wasn't acted on at the time) which pertains to you just saying weird stuff - calling people schizophrenic, disparaging remarks or sentiment towards certain groups... and I don't even know how to interpret WTF I'm reading here but it seems you're trying to accuse someone of grooming:

Spoiler: Chat snippet

Your chat logs also have other assorted snippets of disrespectful remarks:

Spoiler: Cut down for post size

and this is just downright hilarious to me. We don't reject applications publicly out of respect for the applicant, but since you threw the first stone here, I'll thank you not to lie and pretend your application was accepted.



In this most recent incident where things finally boiled over, it seems like you got into some back-and-forth with a staff member on issues surrounding the war in Ukraine and the use of pro-war symbols, bringing up what he told you was Russian propaganda, and generally making a nuisance of yourself. Several of our staff have had enough of your general demeanor and I specifically received comments to the effect that it only changed after the ball dropped and you were banned.

At the end of the day... I've come to the conclusion that no, I can't point to any one particular thing that is a clear cut justification of a permanent ban, but you said it best yourself not too long ago:



Well what do you know, if only we had some sort of rule against that...
You are exemplifying the exact reason we have our brown-hat rule (#5), of which three particular points are relevant here:

• Disrespecting admin requests, heckling staff, or direct admin attacks
• Deliberately doing things to annoy people after they've politely asked you to stop.
• Intentionally starting drama or bringing up controversial subjects to start arguments (aka trying to “trigger” people)

and I am inclined to agree with the staff consensus that some sort of ban is indeed warranted, but that one of fixed length isn't going to have the desired effect of making you reconsider your behaviour. You acknowledged being rude/offensive to people after the fact, and then go right back to more of the same.

nearly forgot, im kinda in a very sticky situation recently in real life (it doesn't explain anything don't take it like that) so im very irritable and can be way easely be triggered

All the more reason for a vacation from our servers. I don't think it's fair for our staff or the rest of the server to have to deal with the fallout while you work things out for yourself.

For these reasons, I'm not going to grant your appeal at this time. However, it may be re-visited in the future at such time we believe that both sufficient time has passed and that you've made a genuine effort to change for the better.

 

[hawaw_dacar2]

Well i hoped i didn't had to do this message but guess im kinda forced to get the whole shit out. This is going south...

Uhh... try 2 months ago. What I gather from that incident is you were being rather aggressive towards one of the TF2C developers and when one of our staff asked you to stop you started getting snippy with them too.

I know who you are talking about and this happened when THE PERSON in question flammed me and then goes on a child ego type fight but the thing you forgot here is that in like in less than 2 games later the person in question told me she wasn't really liking playing like this way and explained to me the whole shit and guess what. We figured the whole shit out and stoped not so long after. Some time after the incident we even started some normal conversation talking about everything and nothing. Just like if talking about the problem dirrectly with the person was the best solution and not trying to get the person big problems. Ain't that so monstruous of me eh ?

There's another report from early July (that wasn't acted on at the time) which pertains to you just saying weird stuff - calling people schizophrenic, disparaging remarks or sentiment towards certain groups... and I don't even know how to interpret WTF I'm reading here but it seems you're trying to accuse someone of grooming:

For the first part. Calling people schizo uhhh. Where ? (bad memory im sorry) And.. Sentiments what the hell is this meaning ? (Sound a bit like a Trial of Intent but whatever i guess) And for the child part. There was a veeerryyy young child in the server doing... things and then some people started to blast some doubtious insult and started go a bit' crazy so at the time i thought this mayyy be inapropriate to say insult and doubtious thing when there is a children near. And for the grooming thing part this wasn't this period this was sometime after when some guy (don't remember the name of that fool) gone crazy about sex and all those shit. But i ain't the one making the rule here or apply them . So again what an enormous bastard i am.

Your chat logs also have other assorted snippets of disrespectful remarks:

Ayaaaa. Out of Context. This message was intended to one of the dev (i don't want you to be implied in all of this but im forced) Wendy joined the server and some guy asked about what is those medals about and i replied with this jokes. Guess what no one seemed to be offensed even the dev itself seemed to like that one (can't find message because its a god damn hell to walk trough the whole server chat history)

and this is just downright hilarious to me. We don't reject applications publicly out of respect for the applicant, but since you threw the first stone here, I'll thank you not to lie and pretend your application was accepted.

Why the hell you mention all of this. This has nothing to do with the rest of the whole story but i guess you need to show how much bad and dumb i am.

In this most recent incident where things finally boiled over, it seems like you got into some back-and-forth with a staff member on issues surrounding the war in Ukraine and the use of pro-war symbols, bringing up what he told you was Russian propaganda, and generally making a nuisance of yourself. Several of our staff have had enough of your general demeanor and I specifically received comments to the effect that it only changed after the ball dropped and you were banned.

For the two first line everything is already in the first message and for the most part subjective That one part that wasn't mentioned ya know ? Who are the so called Several man of the staff ( i know who they are and its still hurts seing that from them) because ya know i would like to just have their version of all of this and talk about it like an adult or smth because compared to what you seem to want me to be (I can do Trial of Intent too see ? Ain't it annoying ?) i don't remember talking on the back of others. When there was a problem i TALKED with the person looking him straight up in the eye. And surely im the only problem here from the look of the last part of the message. Guess its too hard for people to adress the problem dirrectly with the man in question. Who knows maybe every single part of this could have been stopped with just... Talk and not a knife in the back.

At the end of the day... I've come to the conclusion that no, I can't point to any one particular thing that is a clear cut justification of a permanent ban, but you said it best yourself not too long ago:

Taking an modified MGS quote seriously ? nice. This was a response for one of my friend who i said i do drama. "I can't point to any one particular thing that is a clear cut justification of a permanent ban" don't know what its supposed to mean then.

• Disrespecting admin requests, heckling staff, or direct admin attacks
• Deliberately doing things to annoy people after they've politely asked you to stop.
• Intentionally starting drama or bringing up controversial subjects to start arguments (aka trying to “trigger” people)

For the first one i guess pointing their errors or asking question was the reason. Btw What do we do about the rule breaking from their part (you forgot ?) ? Its excused ain't it... seems i don't have the right for the forgiveness part.

For the second i explained myself. Whatever people says, when they ask politely i reconsider myself and even sometime say sorry

For the third what should i say about it ? Idk this is just a bit vague. Contreversial subjects are subjective and by the look of the chat after i was sent to the bottom of the ocean. They didn't understood and even some said it was bullshit and irrelevant.

and I am inclined to agree with the staff consensus that some sort of ban is indeed warranted, but that one of fixed length isn't going to have the desired effect of making you reconsider your behaviour. You acknowledged being rude/offensive to people after the fact, and then go right back to more of the same.

So its a decision of YOU because (maybe i didn't understood. Idk im stupid i guess), I never claimed to be a saint (sorry for being honest). Do you even know me ? Did you even played with me once ? You know the man just from corridor sound's not much more

All the more reason for a vacation from our servers. I don't think it's fair for our staff or the rest of the server to have to deal with the fallout while you work things out for yourself.

Fat luck im already doing so. I always did and i don't think you would like to hear about the whole story

For these reasons, I'm not going to grant your appeal at this time. However, it may be re-visited in the future at such time we believe that both sufficient time has passed and that you've made a genuine effort to change for the better.

Will you ? because from the look of that one thread im really depicted like the Public No 1 ennemy. The One That Shall Be Destroyed. What do you mean by effort ? how can i prove i do if i ain't here ? I reallly doubt that last "gentle" part. I already done a big way of smoothing myself since quite a bit and that was the plan for the rest of the time. And the staff and devs seemed to have forgot the time's i defended them from some bad people. Guess this is impossible coming from me.

Even if i do the biggest effort i doubt they will forgive me. I forgave them even after all of this i do. But it seems they will never.

This time there is not much hope left of forgiveness down in this soul... Guess this is the last Run, the last Spark


The biggest monster of all time. Mostly known as Hawaw Dacar....

 

[MoiraPrime]

Please take your persecution complex nonsense somewhere else. You have been skirting the rules for a while now and we've been OVERLY lenient with your behavior.

You are not free to treat our staff like trash, and to repeatedly play toy with the line against our rules. You are not free to iindirectly advocate/argue for genocide in our text chats.

Playing on our servers is a privilege and if you can't respect the very clear rules we have set for conduct on our server, or hell, treat other players and staff with respect, then you will lose that privilege.

As the community manager, I've dealt directly with the concerns multiple staff members have raised, along with the concerning stuff you've posted in chat. As a trans person myself, I don't take it lightly when I see a user make subtle jabs at us, and I'm sure the multiple trans and LGBT people on the dev team of TF2C don't appreciate it either.

I've went through our staff chats and found various evidence our staff have collected about your behavior over the last few months.

I'm going to go by the policy in our server rules and treat this as a 3rd infraction. You are free to appeal your ban again 1 year from its issuance, on September 7, 2024.